This is only semi-related, but…
I was just talking to a friend of mine last night about how at my home church, we never sing hymns. Ever. Only contemporary worship music, which is great. I’ve always really enjoyed it and it makes for great worship (not to imply that music is the only means of worship and all that). But now I’ve moved to college and at the church I’ve been attending and Campus Crusade meetings, hymns are often a part of worship. And I LOVE them. Since I’ve attended my church at home since I was 4, I seriously did not know one single hymn, and I kind of feel like I missed out on some really amazing, heartfelt, beautiful worship music all those years.
I feel like we shouldn’t limit our perception of the kind of church or the kind of music God can use to reach people--contemporary or otherwise.

Interesting timing for me as well, Lindsey.  This morning I signed on to sing on a hymns disc paying tribute to John Wesley’s music.  John Wesley is someone I admire a great deal but I’ve only recently discovered his hymns and they, like his sermons and writings, communicate the bible very clearly to me in ways that a lot of music today just doesn’t.  Not that either of us is bashing modern music either.  I’m sure you love it as much as I do, but, yea, there’s something that connects for some of us in older music.  For me I wonder if it’s just the feeling I get from this music - the feeling that this is a truly old faith, that it’s not a new fad, it’s something brilliant compassionate people through the ages have clung to.  Makes me feel like I’m part of something greater than my personal faith and my local church.

Shaun, that’s awesome about you singing on that hymns tribute album.  I am more than a little bit disenchanted by the sound-alikeness of the songs we sing every week as I like a lot of diversity.  So, the timing is good for me too and I select songs for my small group bible study to sing and tonight we happen to be singing “Before The Throne of God Above” and “I Will Sing of My Redeemer”.  I know Before the Throne is trendy and 4 artists have covered it recently, but the message is fantastic.  Check out the lyrics here: http://www.jesusfreakhideout.com/lyrics/new/track.asp?track_id=6317

The song I’m currently slated to sing on the hymns record is “Jesus The Name High Over All.” I’d never heard it before now but it’s a great lyric.

Before The Throne is a good’un too.

Sally Morgenthaller had some very similar thoughts recently.

Great post Shaun.  I often think of this myself.  If we call our worship contemporary shouldn’t it at least reflect the musical styles that are topping the charts right now?  Not talking about the Christian Worship charts, but the charts that the people we hope to bring into a Christ following walk.  These don’t consist mainly of 80’s-90’s rock, but include hiphop, pop and many other styles.  Yet while David Crowder shows us you can successfully have a rock worship band that integrates loops and a turntable, you still don’t see that much in churches these days.  By the time we do, it will probably have become so old!

I believe a part of this is that as Christians we don’t spend time trying to find out what’s hot and hip.  We have better things to worry about in life.  But if we’re trying to attract those that do using music, at least a few people have to force themselves to become listeners of current music.

And this chap makes such a great point, that we don’t need to put all our focus on this, God’s word and fellowship is truly what should attract us to Church each Sunday morning.  Worship is about giving back to God, not consuming a product that was tailor made to bring you through the doors!

2) It takes actual skill to reproduce what’s on the mainstream charts at any moment.  The truth that goes unspoken is this: Church music guys (and I) aren’t that talented.  We’re good at some stuff, but we’re not good enough musicians (nor are the volunteers in the praise band) to reproduce what’s in mainstream music right now.  If we could, we’d probably, sadly, leave church work and sign with Geffen.  Just saying…

But my thoughts are like Dave’s - that God hasn’t required us to be hot and/or hip.  We’ve got better things to ponder and do. And being like what’s hot and hip is definitely, I believe, not the way the early churches as detailed in the bible grew.  And I’m also doubtful that growing the number of members they had was their goal.

Good thoughts, Dave.

Point 1 disappeared into the blog abyss… It was:

1) Chris Tomlin et al get their songs replayed by churches because they are A)writing music that anyone with basic chord knowledge can play (four chords in C, D, E, or G usually) B)using basic rhythms, nothing more than eights, quarters, halfs, an occasional dot C)writing melodies that fall within the same range as hymns - a great range for singing along D)using phrases we’ve all heard before, rarely employing a metaphor or other lyrical device that requires us to stop and ponder - again, this makes for a high level of participation - singing along, that is E) their music is produced using the instrumentation of your average praise band in a church - nothing to figure out.

My song Your Renown is very singable, straight ahead lyrically, basic chordally BUT the produced version on my first record doesn’t use the usual instruments found on a church stage.  The music guy at the church has to listen to my song and figure out how to translate that into bass, guitar, drums, keyboard.  That’s not something everyone can do.  Music guys SEEM to prefer reproducing music on Sunday morning that sounds like them on the CD.  Any praise team can play Tomlin.  Few can pull of Fergie or Jay-Z convincingly.

Shaun, I’m trying to picture a praise team doing Fergie.  It just isn’t materializing in my head.  Nope.  Can’t see it.

You made a good point, I think, about the hymns having a connection to age-old faith that resonates in us.  To sing about the same God and same blessings that some guy half a world away wrote about 300 years ago - that’s kinda deep, and cool.

Also, I think that these hymns have had the chance to stand the test of time.  There are countless, of course, that were lost in antiquity because they just were not as well received (for many reasons).  When something has been around and is sung continuously for a few centuries, then there has to be something good about it.

I see that Crowder has a cover of “O, For A Thousand Tongues To Sing” on Remedy.  Lots of artists are doing hymns now - maybe a mix of rediscovery and bandwagoning, but still a good thing.

The church I worship with keeps a pretty even mix of hymns and more contemporary songs, and I like it.  Most times, I prefer the hymn; but at times I prefer the simplicity of the modern songs that lend for me letting go of myself and fully engaging in worship.

euphrony, I know this predates Fergie, but Black eyed Peas have a great song to do at church called “Where is the love”.  I suggested that at my previous church, but it was a ‘pass’.

I agree Shaun that it is the “church (501c)” job to attract people. It is the churches(us) job to love people and be there for them and to serve them. I don’t need to subscribe to a certain center to do the job for me.

Oops I mean I agree it is NOT the “churches"(501c3) job to attract people. But that is the business churches are in, to attracts people, but that is what all businesses are trying to do, attract people.

we did Where is the Love at Sandals Church. It was awesome.

Interesting discussion. I was a Music Major with an emphasis in Church Music (aka the small group of students who want to lead worship), where we studied everything from emerging worship to the ancient hymns of the first few centuries.  in our hymnology class we studied the hymns and their authors and composers.  there is so much richness in the hymns. I think the problem is in the way that hymns are done these days, without passion.  When they are done with passion and significance, (and more instrumentation) they hold greater meaning than just singing along with the organ and the “song leader” that can’t sing in the small country church.  I think some of us have separated ourselves from hymns in an attempt to find the fire and the passion.  I believe strongly that “modern” worship is good because they are prayers and they get us singing prayers.  There is so much that can be said, but these are just a few of my many thoughts..being one who is very interested in worship music and music in the church.  It is interesting that the author of the article above says that the music doesn’t matter in their selection of churches because I think it matters a great deal because God is the creator of creativity and we create to glorify our Creator, to express things that overflow from our hearts through melodies and in praise and adoration, in crying out.  When the music is done in a half-hearted, unorganized or careless manner, without excellence, it detracts people like me.  That is not to say that everyone in the country church doesn’t have passion or isn’t really worshiping, but for people like me, i honestly struggle to worship in that situation.

I agree that the community aspect of being involved in church is important, but if you can’t worship in that setting, isn’t it just about seeing a bunch of people you know?

While I like some of Chris Tomlin’s music (I LOVE the cover of Amazing Grace!), most of it sounds all alike.  Not bad, just not full of variety.  I love the old hymns I grew up with too.  There is (for me) a deeper sense of worship because of the lyrics and the music.  Hymms just played on the piano are beautiful to me.  Chris Rice’s “Living Room Sessions” of hymns is wonderful.  Something that has helped me to really appreciate the older hymns is learning the stories BEHIND how or why some of them were written.

That being said, I agree completely that music does not equal worship in and of itself.  The church should be attracting people to it’s doors with it’s relationship, descipleship, accountability, and sound Bible doctrine.  Of course, the non-believer may not realize that’s what they’re looking for initially.  Hopefully though, we’re not inticing people to attend under false pretenses (ie: “the music’s great, hang with us” or “we can relate to you ‘cause our music is ‘contemporary’").  That’s living a lie and something The church should NOT be practicing.
Beth

Shaun - found your “shlog” thru Brian Seay’s sight. We’re from Houston (although spent several years in Nville in the late 90s),and grew up with the Seay’s (more Robbie, than Brian and Chris), but play poker with Chris now on occasion (is that allowed to be made public—it’s innocent i assure everyone --- although he usually comes out smelling like a rose!!). Anyway...found this post very interesting.

We have (3) young girls and put them to sleep each night with Fernando Ortega’s latest release: “The Shadow of Your Wings”. If I try to change it, they ask for the “piano music”. I love what he has done with his career and gifts, and how his focus has been on turning this generation (and others), on to old and new hymns. He has “bucked” the system, to say the least, but has had great success, especially as of late with Curb. Listening to him talk (at the 1-2 shows I’ve seen), is like hearing ancient wisdom, and he paints imagery unlike few I’ve heard (i.e., ‘Old Girl’ or ‘Winter Song’ from the “Home” album)

Your thoughts....or anyone else’s. I didn’t see anyone post about his interpretations in the ‘comments’.

Great to be reading your “shlog”!!

-Brandon from H-Town

"I take issue with Trevin’s (seemingly) implying that church is a place, that people must be brought there and that attracting more folks of any generation is the task of a church...”

Ah, the heart of the issue… couldn’t agree more, Shaun.

I don’t care whether people like my church or not.  I don’t invite them on “Friend Day” so I can get a little pin for inviting the most “lost” people. 

I have enough trouble trying to do what Jesus asked us to do (Love the LORD your God w/ all your heart, soul, mind, and strength & love your neighbor as yourself) without all the added distraction of trying to make church “cool”, or convince my neighbors that they should go there.

Shaun,

Can you tell me the name of the CD that has Jesus The Name High Over All on it?  If you could email me I would greatly apreciate it. 

I have to say this is one of the most proactive, intelligent ways of promoting a class by actually being smart about answering questions people would really have. Not the JESUS DIED, JESUS LIVED, JESUS AROSE as an answer to all questions.

I just watched Lufthansa flight 423 take off over my house. This flight was operating a 747-400 to Frankfurt.

Not only did Boston rock Denver in baseball last night, the Street Dogs rocked our ear holes at the Ogden theatre as well. It just hurts so good…

Zach-

It may have been originally by Charles Wesley (the father of the founder of the Methodist Church?) and written in 1749. 

Here are the lyrics:

http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Jesus!_the_Name_High_over_All