Yes, I know what you’re thinking, “Mary Ann’s starting another thread??”
What are everyone’s opinions of “Christian” music/lyrics?
Like it? Very much dislike it? In between?
Why do you think it stinks?
What would make it better?
Once you move beyond of the absolute truth of God, the quality of a lyric is very much dependent on the conversation going down between the artist and the listener. What speaks His truth to me may bounce off your head and confuse your heart - and vice-versa.
It stinks when it communicates a lie and fault can’t be credited to the listener.
I’m not asking everyone to disect every aspect of Christian music and point out every little thing, I just want to know what comes to your mind when I ask what do you like most / dislike most about Christian music. Do you agree that many song lyrics lack artistic value? Does it seem that most ‘Christian’ songs sound alike? Would you rather hear something original, good words mixed with unbridled art, or something that sounds a lot like a particular secular artist/band you really like but can’t listen to?
If anyone can think of just one thing they particularly wish would change about Christian music, or something they hope never changes, please talk about it. I really want to know. (I’m taking notes).
I’ve spent a small amount of time in a few online communities of Christians writing music. Almost all of what I read and heard failed to appeal to me personally - but I found it very difficult to write a fair critique that goes beyond, “well, your song just doesn’t speak to me.” Should I be so bold as to presume that anything that doesn’t appeal to me lacks artistic value?
And as to your next question - it seems to me that many blues tunes sound alike. Same with big band, bebop and free jazz ... if a waltz starts sounding like rap, I think my complaint would be that all rap sounds alike - not that I’d just heard the most unusual classical piece. Originality is very hard to come by, I’m afraid.
The only other thing to come to mind is a favorite quote of mine by Maritan, “If you want to make a Christian work, then be Christian, and simply try to make a beautiful work, into which your heart will pass; do not try to “make Christian."”
This is a good question and ties in to Shaun’s series about Christian radio. I started really collecting and listening to Christian music 11 years ago and became a Christian 8 years ago. I still collect secular music as well and I don’t notice any difference in quality or songwriting or musicianship at this point. Variety used to be an issue, but all the same genres are basically available in Christian or secular. So, message is really the key and just like on the Christian radio thread, the only frustration with Christian radio is that strong messages may not be getting the exposure they deserve because they are not “happy” messages, which is clearly a difference in formats.
As for my definition of good music since I collect fairly equally the fact that 20 of my top 25 most listened to songs on my iPod are Christian, I’d say personally I’m leaning towards Christian overall as truly being good music.
i find myself getting tired of a lot of the christian music that is out these days. and please dont think that i am trying to come down hard on the artist who i know are writing out of a passion and love for God and a desire to share His love with others. but to me… it all feels a little “me” centered. lyrics along the lines of “i am so tired and hungry and weary of the hard things i face and the storms” or “Lord help me cuz im struggling” etc. are just… becoming redundant, and i think maybe we might be losing focus a little bit. now, certainly not ALL music is like that and its not that i dont like those kinds of songs. i just wish we could hear a little more praising God because He IS God, not because of what we are or are not going through in our lives, you know? i remember that growing up our songs were simple, short, to the point, and full of praise and worship for God just because of who He is, not because of who we are or what we are going through. i like chris tomlin and david crowder because they are both writing songs of just plain adoration and praise of God, no strings attached. and they both write so freely. they dont limit themselves to repetition and redundancy.
sorry if this sounds harsh. i dont mean it to be. its just some frustration thats been building in me lately, especially since my local christian radio station likes to play the same songs over and over in a day, and most only songs that are current (like released in the last year). maybe it shouldnt matter so much that the songs arent what i like, and maybe i should work on getting over my wearied feeling every time i hear a song for the 4th time in one day.
i am grateful, so grateful, for christian music and for artists like shaun and chris rice and pcd and all those great men and women who pour their passion and hearts for God into their music and lyrics. there are songs that have touched my life that i can imagine never hearing, because they describe me right where i am at and point me to God. its a beautiful thing we have here.
It depends. I don’t like manufactured music, no matter how Godly or spiritual it is. I like artists who are very “hands on” - artists who write, play, sing, produce. I think artists that are that involved with their music will stick around for the long haul because that is what they love to do.
One group that I admit to liking, but have grown tired of, is Avalon. I used to love their older material, but I got tired of them because they kept switching up band members and their music started to sound the same album after album. They didn’t keep my interst, which is too bad, because I thought they had potential.
Examples of some artists/bands that I like - including Shaun - is Jars of Clay, The Elms, and Mark Schultz. It isn’t a long list. I do own quite a few Christian CDs, but out of all of them, these four artists I really see sticking around and making music forever. They have too much talent and heart not to.
As a parent of a 7 and 10 year old boy.... we lean toward the Christian music, All the way from DC Talk to Christ Tomlin, Todd Agnew to Thousand Foot Crutch. My son goes into his grade 4 class and hears about Green Day and ACDC. The music along with the rest of the foundation we are building for our kids is really important to us. I’m not so hung up on the whys of the artist writing the song necessarily but that it is sound and matches what me and my dh are teaching our kids. I’m not too theological really.... I just strive to live my life as Jesus in skin and I want that to reflect in the music I listen to.
Now, I’ve been on the other side… done the bar scenes etc., have always loved music and don’t judge what others listen too. My opinion is just that… My opinion. To each their own… ROCK ON!!!!
I"ll be the bad guy. What is “bad.” I’ll give you an example of what I think is a very bad lyric.
Superchick’s Stand In The Rain.
Here’s why:
1. Rain. How many times have we heard a song centering around rain or a storm? This is an overused metaphor so, for me, it’s like wallpaper. I don’t notice it any more. It’s been done so often that it now lacks power - for me.
2. Stand. Again, this is an overused word. Take a stand. Stand and deliver. Stand by me.
3. Rhyme scheme. The rhyme scheme is AAAAAAAAAAA. Every line rhymes with the one before it. This can be a great rhyme scheme to use...in a children’s book. Dr. Seuss, for instance…
4. Down. It’s lazy to use the word “down” as often as these folks do in this song. They rhyme down with down. They rhyme down with drown, found, around. They use down in the chorus and the verse - every verse, every chorus. It’s lazy writing. It’s what a thesaurus is for.
5. Lost will be found. I know it’s in the bible. But communicate the idea and not the exact words and you’d get my attention. It’s a powerful idea that God has found the lost. Why not invest some thought into how to say that in a way that has power today - not in a way we’ve heard it communicated a thousand times before. Truth is, I suspect, they used this cliche because it rhymed with “down.”
That’s a bad lyric from a songwriter’s perspective. Taking the easiest route isn’t “good” to songwriters because it takes no skill. It’s not morally bad. And a “bad” song is still used by God to do amazing things in the lives of listeners. But from a purely crafting point of view? It sucks.
I agree. I think some of the songs that speak most profoundly to me do not come right out and say what the artist is trying to convey in the straight forward words. “Jesus” is one of my favorite songs because it really makes me think about the kinds of people described therein. If I can truly learn to see Jesus in these people, in all people for that matter, and then LOVE them as Jesus does, then that’s what really matters. Two songs by Taylor Sorenson affect me the same way. “Bulletproof” and “A Thing Called Love” are great musically, but they also paint an excellent picture of what it really means to be sold out for Christ. When I choose to act like the truly bulletproof individual I really am, then I will completely sold out for Christ. It’s a moment by moment choice for me that’s for sure.
Shaun, your analysis sounds a lot like what goes on in my head when I try to pick out new singles for True Story Radio. I belong to a service for radio types and get the latest releases every week. I can only stand to go in there about once a month though because it’s so discouraging and I honestly end up getting mad. So much of the music I’m offered is average sounding and the rhymes are predictable, the lyrics are cliched and sometimes, the theology is off. I can’t play stuff for the True Story crowd that I’d gag listening to on my own mp3 player.
The combination of music and lyrics is really important. As much as I like to offer songs with hefty lyrics, I will go with a song that has a slightly weaker lyric if the song is really catchy. And I won’t usually pick a song with great lyrics if the song sounds bad/boring/too dated. I’ll make an exception with the “dated” part if it’s a Christian music oldie that people know and love and that really fits whatever topic the show’s about that week.
Lyrics are tres importante to me in music. If you can write lyrics that stand alone as poetry (for example Paul Simon’s sound of silence) that amazes me.
I love to see things in a new way or have an idea or feeling of my own expressed in words for the first time through someone’s lyrics. (or poetry or novel, but we’re talking music here)
So I can agree with Shaun’s point, I tire of hearing overused words/metaphors/lyric in songs. Especially Christian songs. Sometimes when listening to the radio, I cringe at the words, at their overuse or if they sound too forced. But, since I am a writer myself, I know that it’s really HARD to come up with something fresh to make all the pieces fit together in a way that is satisfying. For me, there are times when it flows out of me, and other times when I couldn’t string two words together to save my life.
I agree that quality lyrics are also the key to “good music” and I think that is part of what makes a catchy song turn bad (Macarena, etc.) and an artistic song turn catchy (Mockingbird, etc.). I like the “Sound of Silence” example of staying power of a song based on quality lyrics. As much as I like Neil Diamond for example, I can only make fun of “Song Sung Blue” at this point. I mean is rhyming “sleeping on my pillow” with “weeping like a willow” something Shaun would do? Actually, I take it back. That’s actually brilliant because sleeping and weeping also rhyme (sarcasm intended).
The Superchic(k) song is a good example in Christian music but there are bad lyrics everywhere. Thanks for weighing in on this topic Shaun.
It depends. I don’t like manufactured music, no matter how Godly or spiritual it is. I like artists who are very “hands on” - artists who write, play, sing, produce. I think artists that are that involved with their music will stick around for the long haul because that is what they love to do.
~Jessica
Jessica, I am helping host Shaun at Calvary Church next month (July 15th) at our Sunday evening service called resonate starting at 6 p.m. where Shaun will be teaching us and then doing a short concert afterwards at 8 p.m. for Compassion. I look forward to meeting you and anyone else on the board from the PA area.
I totally agree with your quote above about what good music is. In addition to the Christian artists you named I’d add David Crowder, Matt Redman, Martin Smith (Delirious), Mac Powell (Third Day), Aaron Shust, Matthew West and Todd Agnew in addition to Shaun, Jars of Clay and Andrew Peterson as my top 10 favorite Christian singer-songwriters.
I’m not asking everyone to disect every aspect of Christian music and point out every little thing, I just want to know what comes to your mind when I ask what do you like most / dislike most about Christian music. Do you agree that many song lyrics lack artistic value? Does it seem that most ‘Christian’ songs sound alike? Would you rather hear something original, good words mixed with unbridled art, or something that sounds a lot like a particular secular artist/band you really like but can’t listen to?
If anyone can think of just one thing they particularly wish would change about Christian music, or something they hope never changes, please talk about it. I really want to know. (I’m taking notes).
Mary Ann,
I’ve been listening to tons of music lately (the summer is a great time for that) and right now I’m noticing that the hot trend in secular music is 80’s-style electronica, emo, rock (Hellogoodbye, The Killers, Fall Out Boy) along with dance (Fergie, Furtado, Stefani) and as much as I love Christian music, there really aren’t a lot of Christian alternatives right now. I think TobyMac is the best in the dance category and I love Future of Forestry in the emo/rock/electronica category.
So, if I could change one thing about Christian music, it would be for even more diversity than now. My oldest daughter is 7 1/2 and has friends who think Black Eyed Peas/Fergie, etc. are cool, and back in 1999 I could have played her Worldwide Message Tribe and Raze but today I don’t have a lot of options. If you know of any, please let me know as I’d like to hear some great upbeat Christian alternatives in that dance/electronica category.
